The Darts Forum

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:51 pm

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:50 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:49 pm

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:48 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:46 pm Durrant?

"I could see arguments for a few others"

Duzza would be one of those.

Mitchell?

Only in your egg shaped head.

Clayton was elite at some point

And still is

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:51 pm Clayton was elite at some point

If you read the names on my list do you think his name belongs beside them?

Genuine question btw.

Deadshot wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:17 pm To be at the top end as long as he has, certainly an argument but until he wins a major there will always be a debate

This.

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:56 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:51 pm Clayton was elite at some point

If you read the names on my list do you think his name belongs beside them?

Genuine question btw.

Not really. Well at some point I think he was up there, just couldn't keep it up

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:45 pm Similar debate to whether Zlatan Ibrahimovic was an elite player or not

Which he clearly was. It’s not even debatable.

Elite not only plays to the highest standard, but has the major tournament TV wins to back it up. The huge elite is Taylor, MvG and Bristow, with Barney right there too. There are other players who can play the highest standard but not consistently, some of those might win TV majors (like Clayton) and others might not win any (like Chisnall). There are other players who play at the highest standard perhaps less often but find ways to win a lot of TV majors because of very good timing and finishing (Wade).

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:59 pm

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:56 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:51 pm Clayton was elite at some point

If you read the names on my list do you think his name belongs beside them?

Genuine question btw.

Not really. Well at some point I think he was up there, just couldn't keep it up

His PL and GP wins are not to be sniffed at. However, he hasn't won a singles TV event since 2021 and he's never cracked top 5 in the OOM (would have done in 2021, but almost all the TV events he won were exbos)

A World title would probably see him make my cut.

Barney

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:56 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:51 pm Clayton was elite at some point

If you read the names on my list do you think his name belongs beside them?

Genuine question btw.

Regarding Clayton. Absolutely he should be on the list. He won FOUR majors in one season, two of which were the PL and Grand Prix. Now it could be argued he was a one season wonder regarding winning majors.
But I don’t think any other player other than Taylor and MVG have won 4 or more majors in one season. In 2021 he was clearly elite and for a time arguably the best player in the world.

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:02 pm Barney

I can remember him at his best. Like, for example, at the 2007 Masters of Darts, he beat Manley in the final 7-0 in sets with a 108 average. Most of "headshaker" Barney comes from what Taylor did to him 2008-2010 time, not helped by diabetes diagnosis.

PT13 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:04 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:02 pm Barney

I can remember him at his best. Like, for example, at the 2007 Masters of Darts, he beat Manley in the final 7-0 in sets with a 108 average. Most of "headshaker" Barney comes from what Taylor did to him 2008-2010 time, not helped by diabetes diagnosis.

2008-2023

15 years

won fuck all!!!

HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:00 pm

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:45 pm Similar debate to whether Zlatan Ibrahimovic was an elite player or not

Which he clearly was. It’s not even debatable.

Never won the Champions League, which is crazy when you look at his club history.

I agree he's elite though, but that's what causes much of the debate ^

HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:03 pm Regarding Clayton. Absolutely he should be on the list. He won FOUR majors in one season, two of which were the PL and Grand Prix. Now it could be argued he was a one season wonder regarding winning majors.
But I don’t think any other player other than Taylor and MVG have won 4 or more majors in one season. In 2021 he was clearly elite and for a time arguably the best player in the world.

I don't consider the WS or Masters to be majors.

Had he won the Worlds in 2021 and a few other TV events he'd be there, but I'm not sure if the GP and PL alone is enough.

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:05 pm

PT13 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:04 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:02 pm Barney

I can remember him at his best. Like, for example, at the 2007 Masters of Darts, he beat Manley in the final 7-0 in sets with a 108 average. Most of "headshaker" Barney comes from what Taylor did to him 2008-2010 time, not helped by diabetes diagnosis.

2008-2023

15 years

won fuck all!!!

2012 Grand Slam of Darts. 2014 Premier League. Not fuck all.

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:05 pm

PT13 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:04 pm

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:02 pm Barney

I can remember him at his best. Like, for example, at the 2007 Masters of Darts, he beat Manley in the final 7-0 in sets with a 108 average. Most of "headshaker" Barney comes from what Taylor did to him 2008-2010 time, not helped by diabetes diagnosis.

2008-2023

15 years

won fuck all!!!

GSOD and PL.

Non ranking pissups

Even if we discount what Headshaker has done over the past decade, he was 100% an elite player in the late 90s and throughout the 2000s.

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:05 pm

HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:00 pm

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:45 pm Similar debate to whether Zlatan Ibrahimovic was an elite player or not

Which he clearly was. It’s not even debatable.

Never won the Champions League, which is crazy when you look at his club history.

I agree he's elite though, but that's what causes much of the debate ^

I will create a thread

The Thorn wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:09 pm

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:05 pm

HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:00 pm

TheMalteseDart wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 10:45 pm Similar debate to whether Zlatan Ibrahimovic was an elite player or not

Which he clearly was. It’s not even debatable.

Never won the Champions League, which is crazy when you look at his club history.

I agree he's elite though, but that's what causes much of the debate ^

I will create a thread

Post count is on fire this evening. Oche is the cause of it and he's made about 3 posts

sennafan24 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:06 pm

HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:03 pm Regarding Clayton. Absolutely he should be on the list. He won FOUR majors in one season, two of which were the PL and Grand Prix. Now it could be argued he was a one season wonder regarding winning majors.
But I don’t think any other player other than Taylor and MVG have won 4 or more majors in one season. In 2021 he was clearly elite and for a time arguably the best player in the world.

I don't consider the WS or Masters to be majors.

Had he won the Worlds in 2021 and a few other TV events he'd be there, but I'm not sure if the GP and PL alone is enough.

Without wanting to recycle the old what constitutes a major debate. Whether you like it or not, they are officially considered majors and will count towards his record. They are arguably the 2 lowest prestige majors though.