How much......

[Randall]

Just because you disagree doesn't make it nonesense

[HalloweenJack]

Much bigger than most think I suspect and the body of evidence keeps growing. It would be a strange coincidence for all of Dimitri winning the Matchplay, Durrant winning the PL and the two of the best players in the world not even making the PL playoffs to happen this year and those occurances be independant of the freak circumstances.

I guess with comments like that, you think that John Lennon and Elvis Presley are still alive
Please provide tangible evidence to suggest no crowds is affecting players performance.

[HalloweenJack]

Just because you disagree doesn't make it nonesense

Everybody is entitled to their opinion, but until there is tangible evidence to back up some of the claims, in my mind they are nonsense.
I have been referred to as a contrarian, yet the opinions of some in thin thread are just that.
Still I guess the beauty of free speech is that we can all express our opinion on here

[Randall]

Opinions are like assholes
In this case neither of us will ever know
Plus it's good for the post count

[sennafan24]

Nothing fortunate about his or DVDB success.

They were fortunate though. Very fortunate that the PDC's top players have lost their consistency/form in recent months.

Duzza averaged a shade below 89 in the PL Playoffs, by far the lowest of any PL winner in that stage of the tournament. As much as people complain about Wade winning TV events without beating Taylor, at least he averaged over 90 in the playoff stage of the 2009 PL. The same applies for Anderson in 2011, who averaged over 95 in the playoff stage of that year's PL.

2-3 years ago Dimi, Dirk and Duzza would not have had a sniff of winning a TV event with MVG at the top of his game, Taylor still knocking about, and Cross in good form. With the fields as open as they are at present time, however, very good but not great players have a decent chance of winning TV events.

Essentially, the likes of Dimi, Duzza, etc are what they are, very good players, but not elite.

[Tommo]

Is the lack of crowds influencing 2020 results? YES
Clearly to the viewer it makes toss all difference, but the players? YES

Would dimi really have won under normal circumstances? NO
Would dulla have won at the 02? NO

Can mvg get al really not get motivated? NO

[Randall]

Is the lack of crowds influencing 2020 results? YES
Clearly to the viewer it makes toss all difference, but the players? YES

Would dimi really have won under normal circumstances? NO
Would dulla have won at the 02? NO

Can mvg get al really not get motivated? NO

The conditions absolutely are influencing results and performance as far as I'm concerned
No bigger dimi fan than me but he would never have won in Blackpool

[tungsten tossers]

it is probably a mixture of the whole situation... Mexican beer fear, lockdowns, bubbles, hassle with travel, confined in a hotel for the tournaments, no crowds, disruption to practise etc. Some people don't like too much change in one go.
I know some people that have totally changed since March, and tbh, they are like a totally different person.
Maybe the likes of MvG, Gando, Crusty, Bully and some of the other players that don't need the money, are maybe not as motivated as they would otherwise have been.
I don't see the desire in most of the top players at the moment

[Rogg]

The conditions absolutely are influencing results and performance as far as I'm concerned
No bigger dimi fan than me but he would never have won in Blackpool

In the space of a few hours you've gone from "we'll never know" to "he would never have won"... fair enough.

Would Price have won the Grand Prix in regular conditions? I don't know how it's possible to say anything here with certainty.

[HalloweenJack]

Nothing fortunate about his or DVDB success.

They were fortunate though. Very fortunate that the PDC's top players have lost their consistency/form in recent months.

Duzza averaged a shade below 89 in the PL Playoffs, by far the lowest of any PL winner in that stage of the tournament. As much as people complain about Wade winning TV events without beating Taylor, at least he averaged over 90 in the playoff stage of the 2009 PL. The same applies for Anderson in 2011, who averaged over 95 in the playoff stage of that year's PL.

2-3 years ago Dimi, Dirk and Duzza would not have had a sniff of winning a TV event with MVG at the top of his game, Taylor still knocking about, and Cross in good form. With the fields as open as they are at present time, however, very good but not great players have a decent chance of winning TV events.

Essentially, the likes of Dimi, Duzza, etc are what they are, very good players, but not elite.

Dimi has plenty of time to become a so called elite player. I also think Duzza will win a t least one more premier event. Time will tell. Taylor and MVG for how good they have been, others still won events. Robert Thornton won 2 premier events against Taylor and MVG so others can win too. We will never know with Duzza as he wasn’t in the PDC then. The fact MVG has had a dip in form shouldn’t be a detriment to other players doing well.
Even with crowds there were unhearalded players who got to finals eg Kirk Sheppard. So if the world final this year is Gerwyn Price v Mark McGeeney are you going to say it’s due to no crowds??
Until there is any factual evidence to prove that Dimi or Duzza ( who was top of the league before lockdown) are only winning because of no crowds then it’s pure fantasy in my eyes.
With the current situation with Covid who knows when crowds will be allowed back to watch darts? I doubt it’s happening this year.

[HalloweenJack]

The conditions absolutely are influencing results and performance as far as I'm concerned
No bigger dimi fan than me but he would never have won in Blackpool

In the space of a few hours you've gone from "we'll never know" to "he would never have won"... fair enough.

Would Price have won the Grand Prix in regular conditions? I don't know how it's possible to say anything here with certainty.

+1

It’s pure speculation.

[Randall]

The conditions absolutely are influencing results and performance as far as I'm concerned
No bigger dimi fan than me but he would never have won in Blackpool

In the space of a few hours you've gone from "we'll never know" to "he would never have won"... fair enough.

Would Price have won the Grand Prix in regular conditions? I don't know how it's possible to say anything here with certainty.

We will never know for sure but I know what I believe

[Randall]

it is probably a mixture of the whole situation... Mexican beer fear, lockdowns, bubbles, hassle with travel, confined in a hotel for the tournaments, no crowds, disruption to practise etc. Some people don't like too much change in one go.
I know some people that have totally changed since March, and tbh, they are like a totally different person.
Maybe the likes of MvG, Gando, Crusty, Bully and some of the other players that don't need the money, are maybe not as motivated as they would otherwise have been.
I don't see the desire in most of the top players at the moment

No none of this has changed anything and all results would have been the same.

[sennafan24]

Dimi has plenty of time to become a so called elite player. I also think Duzza will win a t least one more premier event. Time will tell. Taylor and MVG for how good they have been, others still won events. Robert Thornton won 2 premier events against Taylor and MVG so others can win too. We will never know with Duzza as he wasn’t in the PDC then. The fact MVG has had a dip in form shouldn’t be a detriment to other players doing well.
Even with crowds there were unhearalded players who got to finals eg Kirk Sheppard. So if the world final this year is Gerwyn Price v Mark McGeeney are you going to say it’s due to no crowds??
Until there is any factual evidence to prove that Dimi or Duzza ( who was top of the league before lockdown) are only winning because of no crowds then it’s pure fantasy in my eyes.
With the current situation with Covid who knows when crowds will be allowed back to watch darts? I doubt it’s happening this year.

I never said that the lack of crowds is a reason why Duzza and Dimi have won TV events.

Kirk Shepherd is actually a very good example of what I am getting at. Barely anyone was playing well at the PDC 2007 World Championship, and after a charmed run, Shepherd managed to reach the final. If McGeeney made the final of the world championship this year it will mostly be because the PDC top players will be out of form or on the decline.

As I have said previously, Duzza is a very good player, but not elite. He's just taken advantage of MVG's and Gando's decline, and had a lot of luck along the way.

[Rogg]

No bigger dimi fan than me

Fight me.

[Randall]

No bigger dimi fan than me

Fight me.

Thumb war?

[Rogg]

No bigger dimi fan than me

Fight me.

Thumb war?

Wash your hands first.

[HalloweenJack]

Dimi has plenty of time to become a so called elite player. I also think Duzza will win a t least one more premier event. Time will tell. Taylor and MVG for how good they have been, others still won events. Robert Thornton won 2 premier events against Taylor and MVG so others can win too. We will never know with Duzza as he wasn’t in the PDC then. The fact MVG has had a dip in form shouldn’t be a detriment to other players doing well.
Even with crowds there were unhearalded players who got to finals eg Kirk Sheppard. So if the world final this year is Gerwyn Price v Mark McGeeney are you going to say it’s due to no crowds??
Until there is any factual evidence to prove that Dimi or Duzza ( who was top of the league before lockdown) are only winning because of no crowds then it’s pure fantasy in my eyes.
With the current situation with Covid who knows when crowds will be allowed back to watch darts? I doubt it’s happening this year.

I never said that the lack of crowds is a reason why Duzza and Dimi have won TV events.

Kirk Shepherd is actually a very good example of what I am getting at. Barely anyone was playing well at the PDC 2007 World Championship, and after a charmed run, Shepherd managed to reach the final. If McGeeney made the final of the world championship this year it will mostly be because the PDC top players will be out of form or on the decline.

As I have said previously, Duzza is a very good player, but not elite. He's just taken advantage of MVG's and Gando's decline, and had a lot of luck along the way.

I wasn’t specifically referring to you regarding your first sentence.
Duzza can only beat what’s in front of him, it’s not his fault players have played poorly against him. As I’ve said previously to Randall, I think it’s some form of subconscious strength he has. His grinding game seems to drag players down, he certainly seems to be a bogey player for MVG.

[Randall]

No bigger dimi fan than me

Fight me.

Thumb war?

Wash your hands first.

My hands have so much alcohol on them it's a miracle they function

[Rogg]

No bigger dimi fan than me

Fight me.

Thumb war?

Wash your hands first.

My hands have so much alcohol on them it's a miracle they function

We know what can happen.