5 years on from the 2011 world championship...

[An Cat Dubh]

The decline of Part, Manley, Mardle & Scholten shown by their rankings after each World Championship from 2007-12

Part
10 - 4 - 4 - 20 - 32 - 23

Manley
4 - 13 - 14 - 27 - 40 - 83

Scholten
5 - 7 - 17 - 37 - 43 - 47

Mardle
9 - 9 - 8 - 22 - 39 - 90

[sennafan24]

Comparing the 2006 players with their 2016 equivalents - really hits home how much the standard has improved. There are few comparisons that are 50/50 - Thornton/Manley, Dudbridge/White, Mardle/Bully and maybe a few that slightly favour 2006 - Part/Bunting, Dennis/VVDV. However, the vast majority of today's players are superior to their 2006 equivalents.

I would wager if you compared the Lakeside line-up from 2006, it would be slightly stronger than today's Lakeside field. As I've said in previous threads, it was 2006/2007 where the tide really started to turn, and the gulf between the fields became a no-context. Before 2006/2007. Taylor was always the best player, and would have still won plenty of World Titles in a combined field, but the BDO field was at least competitive with that of the PDC.

[Justin Credible]

dont buy that.

The PDC was always superior.

Barney went from making martin adams his bitch to giving retirement speeches in las vegas.
Chizzy was a choker then choker now
Ando back then had zero consistency, and did not have for a few years in the PDC either
Klaasen has a lucky year and like webster, thornton and other bdo so called major winners they have ALL claimed the biggest wins of their careers were in the PDC at some point.

For every players that improved after he came to the PDC, there is a former bdo #1 like farmer, kellet, wilson jobbing week in week out
Lakeshite semi finalists like kong and pecker jobbers

[sennafan24]

Oh I agree the PDC was always superior. They had Taylor, and enough top-players to cancel out what the BDO had to offer. The likes of Llyod, Mardle, Dennis, Manley and Part should not be judged on what they became later in their careers. During their prime, they were really good players. For example, would Bunting be capable of holding his nerve like Part did against Taylor at the 2003 Worlds? I wouldn't have thought so.

Remember, I am talking pre-2006 here. The BDO at least had Barney, Hankey, Fordham, King and Adams playing close to their best. They had players who were top 10 calibre for their time, and in Barney's case, top 3. These days, it's arguable that the BDO don't even have a top 16 player in their ranks, let alone a top 10 player.

[Rogg]

Lakeside 2006 only had 8 seeds, so it's hard to find info on who entered it ranked 7-16. Dartsdatabase and wiki only give the 8 seeds... if anyone can find the whole top 16 from 2006, post it up.

So anyway, I've got the top 16 for Lakeside 2007, the first year they used 16 seeds, so I'm using that for a 9-year comparison against the current BDO top 16 (that is the current list 'BDO rankings' on Dartsdatabase, for want of anything better).

--------------

Of the 16 Lakeside seeds in 2007, only Adams and Fitton are still in the top 16.

Below are the 14 players no longer in the top 16, and in bold you see who they've effectively been replaced by in today's top 16:

2007 - 2016


2. Gary Anderson - Glen Durrant
3. Michael van Gerwen - Scott Waites
4. Tony Eccles - Jamie Hughes
5. Mervyn King - Wesley Harms
6. Simon Whitlock - Jim Williams
8. Ted Hankey - Scott Mitchell
9. Vincent van der Voort - Martin Phillips
10. Martin Atkins - Richard Veenstra
11. Niels de Ruiter - Brian Dawson
12. Mike Veitch - Mark McGeeney
13. Shaun Greatbatch - Dean Reynolds
14. John Walton - Geert de Vos
15. Paul Hanvidge - Tony O'Shea
16. Co Stompé - Darius Labanauskas

[Justin Credible]

that is fucking bleak reading

[sennafan24]

That confirms my point. There's been no progression in the Lakeside standard. In fact, it's arguable that it appears to have dipped.

[M H]

Oh I agree the PDC was always superior. They had Taylor, and enough top-players to cancel out what the BDO had to offer. The likes of Llyod, Mardle, Dennis, Manley and Part should not be judged on what they became later in their careers. During their prime, they were really good players. For example, would Bunting be capable of holding his nerve like Part did against Taylor at the 2003 Worlds? I wouldn't have thought so.

Remember, I am talking pre-2006 here. The BDO at least had Barney, Hankey, Fordham, King and Adams playing close to their best. They had players who were top 10 calibre for their time, and in Barney's case, top 3. These days, it's arguable that the BDO don't even have a top 16 player in their ranks, let alone a top 10 player.

Without doubt ten years back the BDO top ten would have been far more competitive against the PDC's but I still think they'd have lost on a head to head. Now it would be a walkover

[Justin Credible]

That confirms my point. There's been no progression in the Lakeshite standard. In fact, it's arguable that it appears to have dipped.

no argument whatsoever, worse it has got, thats a definite

[Rogg]

Of the 16 Lakeshite seeds in 2007, only Adams and Fitton are still in the top 16.

Below are the 14 players no longer in the top 16, and in bold you see who they've effectively been replaced by in today's top 16:

2007 - 2016


2. Gary Anderson - Glen Durrant
3. Michael van Gerwen - Scott Waites
4. Tony Eccles - Jamie Hughes
5. Mervyn King - Wesley Harms
6. Simon Whitlock - Jim Williams
8. Ted Hankey - Scott Mitchell
9. Vincent van der Voort - Martin Phillips
10. Martin Atkins - Richard Veenstra
11. Niels de Ruiter - Brian Dawson
12. Mike Veitch - Mark McGeeney
13. Shaun Greatbatch - Dean Reynolds
14. John Walton - Geert de Vos
15. Paul Hanvidge - Tony O'Shea
16. Co Stompé - Darius Labanauskas

For the sake of being equal, here's how the same 2007-2016 comparison for the PDC looks. Only Taylor, Lewis, Jenkins and Wade of the 2007 world championship seeds are still in the top 16, here's the 12 who are not and who is now in their place:



2007 Worlds seeds - 2016 now

1 Colin Lloyd - Michael van Gerwen
3 Dennis Priestley - Gary Anderson
4 Roland Scholten - Peter Wright
7 Peter Manley - Robert Thornton
8 Wayne Mardle - Michael Smith
9 Denis Ovens - Raymond van Barneveld
10 Ronnie Baxter - Jelle Klaasen
12 Andy Jenkins - Dave Chisnall
13 Kevin Painter - Ian White
14 Mark Dudbridge - Stephen Bunting
15 Chris Mason - Kim Huybrechts
16 Mark Walsh - Vincent van der Voort

[Rogg]

Some fairly comprehensive improvements there, I'd argue. For the BDO, the opposite is probably true.

[M H]

Some fairly comprehensive improvements there, I'd argue. For the BDO, the opposite is probably true.

I think your exercise has highlighted the progression of one against the regression of the other

[Rogg]

Some fairly comprehensive improvements there, I'd argue. For the BDO, the opposite is probably true.

I think your exercise has highlighted the progression of one against the regression of the other

Which we already SUSPECTED eh tdf, interesting to see it expressed by these player-for-player comparsions though I think... can't remember exactly but I think the 2006 BDO stats would show that Jamie Hughes has succeeded Barney. That's a tough one.

[M H]

Some fairly comprehensive improvements there, I'd argue. For the BDO, the opposite is probably true.

I think your exercise has highlighted the progression of one against the regression of the other

Which we already SUSPECTED eh tdf, interesting to see it expressed by these player-for-player comparsions though I think... can't remember exactly but I think the 2006 BDO stats would show that Jamie Hughes has succeeded Barney. That's a tough one.

Sitting back and looking at it player by player as you set it out is a real eye opener. We all knew the BDO had fell by the wayside but the extent is probably more than we gave them credit for

[Jobber]

Lakeshite 2006 only had 8 seeds, so it's hard to find info on who entered it ranked 7-16. Dartsdatabase and wiki only give the 8 seeds... if anyone can find the whole top 16 from 2006, post it up.

So anyway, I've got the top 16 for Lakeshite 2007, the first year they used 16 seeds, so I'm using that for a 9-year comparison against the current BDO top 16 (that is the current list 'BDO rankings' on Dartsdatabase, for want of anything better).

--------------

Of the 16 Lakeshite seeds in 2007, only Adams and Fitton are still in the top 16.

Below are the 14 players no longer in the top 16, and in bold you see who they've effectively been replaced by in today's top 16:

2007 - 2016


2. Gary Anderson - Glen Durrant
3. Michael van Gerwen - Scott Waites
4. Tony Eccles - Jamie Hughes
5. Mervyn King - Wesley Harms
6. Simon Whitlock - Jim Williams
8. Ted Hankey - Scott Mitchell
9. Vincent van der Voort - Martin Phillips
10. Martin Atkins - Richard Veenstra
11. Niels de Ruiter - Brian Dawson
12. Mike Veitch - Mark McGeeney
13. Shaun Greatbatch - Dean Reynolds
14. John Walton - Geert de Vos
15. Paul Hanvidge - Tony O'Shea
16. Co Stompé - Darius Labanauskas

You haven't lived unless you sat through that Hanvidge Vs Nixon last 8 nine set EPIC.



I watched it.




All of it.







To the bitter end.

[KingMervtheFirst]

2007 Worlds seeds - 2016 now

1 Colin Lloyd - Michael van Gerwen
3 Dennis Priestley - Gary Anderson
4 Roland Scholten - Peter Wright
7 Peter Manley - Robert Thornton
8 Wayne Mardle - Michael Smith
9 Denis Ovens - Raymond van Barneveld
10 Ronnie Baxter - Jelle Klaasen
12 Andy Jenkins - Dave Chisnall
13 Kevin Painter - Ian White
14 Mark Dudbridge - Stephen Bunting
15 Chris Mason - Kim Huybrechts
16 Mark Walsh - Vincent van der Voort

It's rather sad how quickly Manley faded from the scene, going from a PL player in 2008 to making his last Ally Pally appearance about eighteen months later. I never liked him much but he did provide colour, with his walk-on routine and his mind games. Not the player you'd want to watch if you desire loads of 180s and high scoring though.

Ovens' high ranking was based almost entirely on his floor game wasn't it? Struggling to recall even a TV QF he ever made.

[Justin Credible]

a myth.

Ovens was fairly "successful" in the uk open, in fact made the semi of that major , 3 times in a row.

[Rogg]

Lakeshite 2006 only had 8 seeds, so it's hard to find info on who entered it ranked 7-16. Dartsdatabase and wiki only give the 8 seeds... if anyone can find the whole top 16 from 2006, post it up.

So anyway, I've got the top 16 for Lakeshite 2007, the first year they used 16 seeds, so I'm using that for a 9-year comparison against the current BDO top 16 (that is the current list 'BDO rankings' on Dartsdatabase, for want of anything better).

--------------

Of the 16 Lakeshite seeds in 2007, only Adams and Fitton are still in the top 16.

Below are the 14 players no longer in the top 16, and in bold you see who they've effectively been replaced by in today's top 16:

2007 - 2016


2. Gary Anderson - Glen Durrant
3. Michael van Gerwen - Scott Waites
4. Tony Eccles - Jamie Hughes
5. Mervyn King - Wesley Harms
6. Simon Whitlock - Jim Williams
8. Ted Hankey - Scott Mitchell
9. Vincent van der Voort - Martin Phillips
10. Martin Atkins - Richard Veenstra
11. Niels de Ruiter - Brian Dawson
12. Mike Veitch - Mark McGeeney
13. Shaun Greatbatch - Dean Reynolds
14. John Walton - Geert de Vos
15. Paul Hanvidge - Tony O'Shea
16. Co Stompé - Darius Labanauskas

You haven't lived unless you sat through that Hanvidge Vs Nixon last 8 nine set EPIC.



I watched it.




All of it.







To the bitter end.

surely the word you are looking for is "classic". Don't think I ever saw HANVIDGE, how very upsetting.

[Justin Credible]

I remember some long drawn out matches at lakeshite and thinking to myself, " what the fuck is wrong with me, why in the blue fuck am I watching this shit"

That was one of those games, not sure why exactly but when cloudy memory thinks of those games I get flashbacks of glen moody's dancing.
Its like flashbacks from overuse of paper suns in the late 80s

[Rogg]

2007 Worlds seeds - 2016 now

1 Colin Lloyd - Michael van Gerwen
3 Dennis Priestley - Gary Anderson
4 Roland Scholten - Peter Wright
7 Peter Manley - Robert Thornton
8 Wayne Mardle - Michael Smith
9 Denis Ovens - Raymond van Barneveld
10 Ronnie Baxter - Jelle Klaasen
12 Andy Jenkins - Dave Chisnall
13 Kevin Painter - Ian White
14 Mark Dudbridge - Stephen Bunting
15 Chris Mason - Kim Huybrechts
16 Mark Walsh - Vincent van der Voort

It's rather sad how quickly Manley faded from the scene, going from a PL player in 2008 to making his last Ally Pally appearance about eighteen months later. I never liked him much but he did provide colour, with his walk-on routine and his mind games. Not the player you'd want to watch if you desire loads of 180s and high scoring though.

Ovens' high ranking was based almost entirely on his floor game wasn't it? Struggling to recall even a TV QF he ever made.

I just checked on Ovens, seeing as apart from his later UK Open runs that JC mentioned, I couldn't remember him doing anything on TV...

2 TV quarter-finals: Vegas 2002, Worlds 2005. Which seems to back up that he was mostly a floor warrior. Plenty of last 16s at the Matchplay and Grand Prix though, he wasn't someone who would go completely to pieces on TV.