1001

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Xaero
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1001

Post by Xaero » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:01 am

Back in the day, in the 70's, there were quite a few matchplay games of 1001 played for money featuring the likes of John Lowe, Alan Evans, Leighton Rees, George Walsh and a few more. Wouldn't it be an idea to set up a tournament under this format?

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Safc
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Re: 1001

Post by Safc » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:07 am

Would be interesting but sadly no chance as Matt Porter ruled it out the other day in his Q & A

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Randall
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Re: 1001

Post by Randall » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:15 am

Would play into the hands of the power scorers all the more.
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sennafan24
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Re: 1001

Post by sennafan24 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:19 am

I liked the idea of a shootout style event. Or perhaps more tournaments with set play.
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Captain Hobo
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Re: 1001

Post by Captain Hobo » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:22 am

I think it'd be a good idea to have a bit of variety in the TV tournaments. The Masters is the obvious one that needs a point of difference. Obviously more set play is needed. Level darts rule is another that I'd like to see.

Sadly from seeing Matt Porter's Q&A it doesn't seem the people in charge think that way.
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JH01
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Re: 1001

Post by JH01 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:45 am

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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The Thorn
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Re: 1001

Post by The Thorn » Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:52 am

The shootout style event is needed, that's pretty obvious.

I personally don't like set play that much, for me the 2 big events we have is enough. Maybe it'd be interesting to see it in some of the smaller ones e.g. a few Euro Tours or World Series, but then you have the scheduling issues with those.

Don't want to see 1001 either. More often than not, the most interesting part in a leg is the setup shots and checkouts phase. 1001 would just mean the scoring phase is drawn out twice as long. Also there'd be a lot more dead legs. Stronger players would probably dominate more. The better players usually score better too so we'd see more one sided games. 501 gives you a bit of leeway, if the opponent misses 2/3 darts at the double you can capitalise on that, would be a lot harder in 1001.

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Randall
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Re: 1001

Post by Randall » Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:34 pm

The Thorn wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:52 am
The shootout style event is needed, that's pretty obvious.

I personally don't like set play that much, for me the 2 big events we have is enough. Maybe it'd be interesting to see it in some of the smaller ones e.g. a few Euro Tours or World Series, but then you have the scheduling issues with those.

Don't want to see 1001 either. More often than not, the most interesting part in a leg is the setup shots and checkouts phase. 1001 would just mean the scoring phase is drawn out twice as long. Also there'd be a lot more dead legs. Stronger players would probably dominate more. The better players usually score better too so we'd see more one sided games. 501 gives you a bit of leeway, if the opponent misses 2/3 darts at the double you can capitalise on that, would be a lot harder in 1001.
My thoughts exactly
501 gives it a balance
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cannibal
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Re: 1001

Post by cannibal » Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:41 pm

FFS, why not bring the darts pentathlon format to a PDC event. Better yet why not have them play some soft top darts as a ranking event. Soft tip cunts around the world would love the confirmation that their arcade game id's a genuine sport.

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Potter's Lake
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Re: 1001

Post by Potter's Lake » Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:36 pm

Having longer legs just wouldn't work for multiple reasons, a prime one being you kill off the excitement of perfect darts/visits, means the crowd have basically zero interest in the start of a leg. Plus on the whole it just makes things more tedious.

Going the other way with say 301 might have some merit, it promotes big finishes ahead of big scores for one, and maybe a sprint to 10 legs might be fun, but having shorter legs would probably be seen as kiddy/amateurish.

So, um, yeah, the whole non fixy non broken thing.
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Captain Hobo
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Re: 1001

Post by Captain Hobo » Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:58 pm

Not sure how so many can say 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' and just leave it at that.

Consider that every single PDC tournament for the whole year, apart from 3, are played under the exact same format, that being 501 straight start leg play, must win by 1 leg only.

The only points of difference left are the Worlds, Matchplay and Grand Prix, and the latter 2 have been dimished by the tiebreaker at the Matchplay and shorter format at the Grand Prix.

I actually think the current calendar is getting so hard to differentiate one tournament from another, that the system IS broken, in a small way. It is certainly broken for any fans who likes variety.

And I know certain posters (Hi Rogg) will say "If you find a tournament boring, you don't have to watch", but what are the other options if you like to watch darts, and you find all but 3 tournaments increasingly boring each year?

For the record, here is what I would change...

Masters - Set play, long format, maybe a new spot in the calendar.

Grand Slam - Set play for knockout stage

World Series of Darts - Leave format as is, but invite a bigger variety of players.

Combine European Championship and PC finals into 1 64 player tournament, Top 32 on both OOMs qualify, rest of the field from a combined Pro Tour OOM. Longer format from QFs on.

Matchplay - I know the tiebreak is here to stay but would love to see the old rule back.

Grand Prix - Tiebreak rule in final set from QFs on, Semis best of 9 sets, Final best of 11.

Edit. Forgot about the World Cup. Should be pairs only in 2nd Round as well.
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JH01
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Re: 1001

Post by JH01 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 12:28 am

Captain Hobo wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:58 pm
Not sure how so many can say 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' and just leave it at that.
I was referring to the idea of starting a leg on 1001. Other posters have highlighted the problems with it, so I'll leave that there.
Captain Hobo wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:58 pm
Consider that every single PDC tournament for the whole year, apart from 3, are played under the exact same format, that being 501 straight start leg play, must win by 1 leg only.

The only points of difference left are the Worlds, Matchplay and Grand Prix, and the latter 2 have been dimished by the tiebreaker at the Matchplay and shorter format at the Grand Prix.

I actually think the current calendar is getting so hard to differentiate one tournament from another, that the system IS broken, in a small way. It is certainly broken for any fans who likes variety.

And I know certain posters (Hi Rogg) will say "If you find a tournament boring, you don't have to watch", but what are the other options if you like to watch darts, and you find all but 3 tournaments increasingly boring each year?

For the record, here is what I would change...

Masters - Set play, long format, maybe a new spot in the calendar.

Grand Slam - Set play for knockout stage

World Series of Darts - Leave format as is, but invite a bigger variety of players.

Combine European Championship and PC finals into 1 64 player tournament, Top 32 on both OOMs qualify, rest of the field from a combined Pro Tour OOM. Longer format from QFs on.

Matchplay - I know the tiebreak is here to stay but would love to see the old rule back.

Grand Prix - Tiebreak rule in final set from QFs on, Semis best of 9 sets, Final best of 11.
I agree with you that many tournaments are too much like each other. What get's me are the 5 or 6 best of 11, 19 and then 21 leg tournaments you get on ITV. I wouldn't bring in double-start or tiebreaks to counteract it. To be honest, I'd scrap The Masters, WSOD Finals and Champions League. Utterly pointless events in my view. It also really irks me that they are considered majors by the PDC.

Having 10 majors a year really seems to destroy the point of them. There are 4 in golf, tennis, and only 3 in snooker, so I would also scrap the Grand Slam as it currently is, and keep the 32 player group stage format for, as you similarly proposed, a combining of the Euro's and Players Finals. I wouldn't touch the original 4.

For financial reasons, I know my utopian ideas wouldn't even get off the ground, but fuck it.

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Captain Hobo
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Re: 1001

Post by Captain Hobo » Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:07 am

I think you're right that the biggest problem with these minor TV events is that they are considered 'Majors' because they are on TV and the first prizes are roughly similar to what traditionalists actually consider majors.

Snooker does a better job of separating out their Triple Crown events from their other TV events, helped by them being the only ones on the BBC.

I assume you mean Worlds, Matchplay, Grand Prix and Premier League are the big 4. I would include the Grand Slam in that as well (after fucking the BDO off and reducing the floor qualifiers), and try and make those 5 the Majors.

They need to raise the Prize Money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam, then you would have some clear difference between these 5 and the other TV tournaments.
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sennafan24
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Re: 1001

Post by sennafan24 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:09 am

I would keep the Champions League. Just because it's the only BBC event. Perhaps change the format though.

I could happily do without the Masters and the WSOD finals.
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Sprocket501
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Re: 1001

Post by Sprocket501 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:22 am

Xaero wrote:Back in the day, in the 70's, there were quite a few matchplay games of 1001 played for money featuring the likes of John Lowe, Alan Evans, Leighton Rees, George Walsh and a few more. Wouldn't it be an idea to set up a tournament under this format?
No. Now fuck off!

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mad jock
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Re: 1001

Post by mad jock » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:57 am

The Thorn wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:52 am
The shootout style event is needed, that's pretty obvious.

I personally don't like set play that much, for me the 2 big events we have is enough. Maybe it'd be interesting to see it in some of the smaller ones e.g. a few Euro Tours or World Series, but then you have the scheduling issues with those.

Don't want to see 1001 either. More often than not, the most interesting part in a leg is the setup shots and checkouts phase. 1001 would just mean the scoring phase is drawn out twice as long. Also there'd be a lot more dead legs. Stronger players would probably dominate more. The better players usually score better too so we'd see more one sided games. 501 gives you a bit of leeway, if the opponent misses 2/3 darts at the double you can capitalise on that, would be a lot harder in 1001.
Yeah i agree, we played 701 in a league game years ago..boozers was nearly closed by the time we got to a double :lol:

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JH01
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Re: 1001

Post by JH01 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:49 am

Captain Hobo wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:07 am
I assume you mean Worlds, Matchplay, Grand Prix and Premier League are the big 4.
I meant the UK Open, completely forgot about the Premier League!
Captain Hobo wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:07 am
They need to raise the Prize Money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam, then you would have some clear difference between these 5 and the other TV tournaments.
Agreed. The prize money went up this year for the Matchplay, but I think for that and the WGP it had remained almost the same for 10 years, allowing lesser TV tournaments to catch up.

I'd also like the PDC just to come out and say, these tournaments are the majors, and these are minor TV events.

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JH01
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Re: 1001

Post by JH01 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:52 am

sennafan24 wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:09 am
I would keep the Champions League. Just because it's the only BBC event. Perhaps change the format though.

I could happily do without the Masters and the WSOD finals.
When it was introduced, I remember thinking that in terms of the format, what's the fucking point? You have the Masters for the top 16, the PL for supposedly 10 top players, why the fuck do you need a competition just for the top 8?

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sennafan24
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Re: 1001

Post by sennafan24 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:06 am

JH01 wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:52 am
sennafan24 wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:09 am
I would keep the Champions League. Just because it's the only BBC event. Perhaps change the format though.

I could happily do without the Masters and the WSOD finals.
When it was introduced, I remember thinking that in terms of the format, what's the fucking point? You have the Masters for the top 16, the PL for supposedly 10 top players, why the fuck do you need a competition just for the top 8?
I can imagine BBC wanted to host a tournament with the top players. The format does ensure that the top players will play several times over the weekend.

But aye, it's not a favourite of mine either.
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Captain Hobo
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Re: 1001

Post by Captain Hobo » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:10 am

JH01 wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:49 am
Captain Hobo wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:07 am
I assume you mean Worlds, Matchplay, Grand Prix and Premier League are the big 4.
I meant the UK Open, completely forgot about the Premier League!
Captain Hobo wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:07 am
They need to raise the Prize Money for the Matchplay, Grand Prix and Grand Slam, then you would have some clear difference between these 5 and the other TV tournaments.
Agreed. The prize money went up this year for the Matchplay, but I think for that and the WGP it had remained almost the same for 10 years, allowing lesser TV tournaments to catch up.

I'd also like the PDC just to come out and say, these tournaments are the majors, and these are minor TV events.
I think the Premier League has prestige due to the money. Got to include it for that reason as the Fifth Major, even though it's an exbo.

I think the Grand Slam is a better candidate for the 4th Ranking Major purely due to the long format, but they need to make it only for PDC players before that can happen.

Now that the 128 Tour Card holders are all at the UK open it kind of feels like a bloated Players Championship. Has lost a lot of its prestige for me.
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