Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Chat and Gossip About Professional and Ever More Farcical BDO Darts
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by JH01 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:22 pm

Indeed. A bit too much love from Glenda there, its the closed eyes as well. One thing I will say for the BDO though, I think the lakeshite trophy is much better than the piece of crap that they hand out at Ally Pally.

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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by Rogg » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:05 pm

cannibal wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:32 pm
JH01 wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:11 pm
cannibal wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:22 pm
Here is two things that I find stupid, repulsive and make players look like right tits.

1) Pictures of winners at darting events "fanning" cash like some piece of shit gangster. I can live with pictures of those stupid novelty checks, as long as the spelling is correct on them. That is about giving title sponsors some due, I can live with that they put the money up they deserve to be in the picture.

2) Kissing trophies. I was just moaning about a certain bag carrier being a bitch, well kissing a trophy makes you look like an even bitchier biotch, if that is possible. Here is a sport that is supposed to be filled with the salt of the earth working men, and here they are giving a good snog to piece of fucking metal. Just cut your balls off for gods sake and start your hormone therapy already.

Fortunately I am so crap at darts I won't have to be put in either of those situations.
Given some of the eyesores that pass for trophies in darts, I'm surprised any player would want to.
Your avatar is the perfect e.g. of an excellent picture of a champion with a trophy. Part is cradling the trophy with affection, appreciation, and satisfaction of his accomplishment. At the same time his eyes are soft and emotional yet you know in the relationship between him and the trophy he is the "top" in the relationship. This is as close to the line of Brokeback Mountain that it should go.

Meanwhile pictures that go full on Brokeback Mountain are a step to far imho. like the following. In this case you know that trophy owns his ass and he isn't complaining.
Image
Never thought about it like that. I don't remember anyone ever helplessly melting into a trophy like Durrant there. Jordan Henderson maybe. When Durrant wins the Sid Waddell Trophy we'll be left wishing he'd only kissed it.

When MVG won his first world title. No reverence, even the first time. Pointing at it and screaming. He was claiming that fucker as rightful property.

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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:36 pm

Glad the US world series stop is done and dusted. If I hear another useless moron claim how the the U.S. qualifiers are getting tougher, the players getting better and how the top players can compete on the PDC tour: I will be begging for a Chris Mason Lump Hammer to crush my fucking skull.

Ok Baggish was a pleasant surprise. Other than that we saw exactly the results of what one should expect given the NA standard of play. Same standard they played last year, difference was no wins this time around and last time they had 2 go thru the 1st round. Count legs if you want but lets be honest that is a shit way to count things because it is about winning, beating who is in front of you and moving thru. Counting legs is just a whinging bitches way of making themselves happy to support the soil their mommy spat them out on. Counting legs is the wooden spoon.

Lets take a look at the claim that the qualifiers are getting tougher. Also with the same stone we will put to death that other stupid claim that the yanks are getting better.
Here is a distribution of the avgs over the last 3 qualifiers:
NA world series qualifiers avgs

2017: 179 players
85+ = 5 3%
80+ = 21 12%
70- = 100 56%

2018: 176 players
85+ = 6 3%
80+ = 21 12%
70- = 112 64%

2019: 190 players
85+ = 8 4%
80+ = 22 12%
70- = 126 66%

So it looks to me the number of players throwing 80 avg or better is about the same. The pile of fodder at the bottom looks to be growing slightly so that is slightly less stagnant than the top level.

So one might argue that the CDC is seeing increased avgs. Yes they are but that is coming from more top players entering events. These players are pushing up the avg of both the CDC qualifiers and the main events. So adding a handful of new quality players to the CDC events has crowded out some of the dross that would come thru the qualifiers and clog up the first round of the main event. So that is a positive thing for the CDC but not having an impact on the NA world series qualifiers because these players would aslo be there as they are in the CDC now.

I personally don't see an improvement in the overall standard for the NA World Series qualifiers, just a new face in Baggish. Which is a positive thing but lets not turn one new player who is more than likely going to flounce off bag to soft tip like Willy B did, into something more.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:13 pm

So lots of activity in the BDO, refs fucking off, new venues, new sponsors, multiple year deals, no more piss potter cup (or is it potter piss cup, either way proper msg conveyed). Many will think the that new venues, new sponsors are a good thing but lets look at this a little deeper. Winmau a long time supporter of the BDO and floating the masters for years abandons the BDO. Not surprising as BDO struggling to get arses in seats and latch on to a TV deal that lasts more than a year or two. Dave TV, CH4 none renewed. That right there tells you all, no money in it. These stations will get more viewers by airing reruns of some 30 year old comedy or some American reality tv like Arse Pickers. Lakeshite 9 days is a big commitment of substantial airtime even if one gets it on the cheap. Probably the reason BT never wanted to do the whole thing, risky to commit to the whole thing.

So now that BDO locked in to a multi year deal with Eurosport\Quest, a couple new sponsors, and looking to do the same with venues. All sounds good doesn't it? And the idea of locking into multi year deals also sounds like a good idea too?? People claiming stability, security, certainty etc...Seems to make sense. But then again the existence of Bigfoot and Ancient Aliens probably make sense to the mushrooms. For the BDO and its diminishing value of products locking into a multi year deal may not be a bad thing if they are making money. The WDT is a millstone, a serious money loser and there does not appear to be any chance of turning that around. The Masters has now lost money and for some time has lost its shine as a "World" title. The BDO Worlds losing viewers, top players, and now a serious chunk of change from Potters Pocket, and a venue they can afford moving to a venue that is going to cost them a load of dosh and puts them right after PDC worlds in London. I am sure Londoners and others in the area are going to flock to a second tier event (more like a fourth tier really) after the main event of championship darts has been done and dusted. The Lakeshite faithful at least gave you a constant set of fans you could count on, can those same faithful be enticed to roll out a wad of cash to do it all in London? I think not, they just lost a good portion of the working class fans who plan for a year ahead to get to the Piss Potter Cup. Granted the Lakeshite was dated, but it ticked the "what we like boxes" of the pikey cluster of fans who go there. BDO has a ton of marketing to do to make these events profitable. Not sure how important venues are when watching or attending but unless they are truly dire shit holes I don't think fans think much about it. Sponsors care more about the overall presentation of an event not where it is held. Ok again you don't want a shit hole but you need atmosphere and good crowd visuals, but most of the action is focused on that tiny stage. A huge empty venue or even a mid size venue is worse than a small venue that generates excitement. Ok the Tavern might be a good fit for the Masters. But they are going to have to do plenty of marketing so that is money out the door there as the milkman brigade isn't going to suffice. Flyers in the butcher shop doesn't cut it either.

Sponsors like One80 and L-Style aren't known or have a history of bringing bags of money to the table. Other than Nodor\Winmau and Unicorn who is the other big name in darts and known to splash money, so why didn't they come to the table to fill the gap and do it on the cheap? Target is the answer and they also make boards, seems to me expanding Targets market share in boards would be an important strategy in the overall brand. So one has to ask the question why didn't they step in and get this on the cheap? They sponsor BDO players, most notably the ladies Champ in Mikuru. I highly doubt One80 and L-Style put more money out to the BDO than Target could. Not convinced the deal One80 and L-style gave the BDO is for much.

Same goes for Eurosport and Quest. Do we really think they are paying much for the rights to one money maker and 2 millstones? These are relatively small players as far as TV market shares go. Eurosport has splashed some money around in certain sports, but those are proven products and given that the cost of those rights probably cost them a big bag of cash or two. They aren't going to be spending much on darts as it is a filler something they can cram in here and there on one of their 4 channels. Quest? does any fucker know where that is on the dial, 257 or something?

End of the day Profits is the same around the globe; Revenues-Cost. I don't see the BDO position being any better, and if your locking yourself into a 3 year deal of losses. Security and certainty in this case is 3 years of losses. That is far worse than a one year deal where you lose, but can then next year make some changes like scraping the WDT for starters.

In short: I think that a lot of mushrooms are polishing turds with this proclaiming a multi year deal is forward progress.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by Randall » Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:18 pm

They are surely relying on the pdc dart crowd to show up?
The pensioners from Lakeshite arent liable to make the trip.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by Rogg » Sun Aug 04, 2019 2:49 pm

God cannibal. That was delicious.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by M H » Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:56 pm

cannibal wrote:
Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:13 pm
So lots of activity in the BDO, refs fucking off, new venues, new sponsors, multiple year deals, no more piss potter cup (or is it potter piss cup, either way proper msg conveyed). Many will think the that new venues, new sponsors are a good thing but lets look at this a little deeper. Winmau a long time supporter of the BDO and floating the masters for years abandons the BDO. Not surprising as BDO struggling to get arses in seats and latch on to a TV deal that lasts more than a year or two. Dave TV, CH4 none renewed. That right there tells you all, no money in it. These stations will get more viewers by airing reruns of some 30 year old comedy or some American reality tv like Arse Pickers. Lakeshite 9 days is a big commitment of substantial airtime even if one gets it on the cheap. Probably the reason BT never wanted to do the whole thing, risky to commit to the whole thing.

So now that BDO locked in to a multi year deal with Eurosport\Quest, a couple new sponsors, and looking to do the same with venues. All sounds good doesn't it? And the idea of locking into multi year deals also sounds like a good idea too?? People claiming stability, security, certainty etc...Seems to make sense. But then again the existence of Bigfoot and Ancient Aliens probably make sense to the mushrooms. For the BDO and its diminishing value of products locking into a multi year deal may not be a bad thing if they are making money. The WDT is a millstone, a serious money loser and there does not appear to be any chance of turning that around. The Masters has now lost money and for some time has lost its shine as a "World" title. The BDO Worlds losing viewers, top players, and now a serious chunk of change from Potters Pocket, and a venue they can afford moving to a venue that is going to cost them a load of dosh and puts them right after PDC worlds in London. I am sure Londoners and others in the area are going to flock to a second tier event (more like a fourth tier really) after the main event of championship darts has been done and dusted. The Lakeshite faithful at least gave you a constant set of fans you could count on, can those same faithful be enticed to roll out a wad of cash to do it all in London? I think not, they just lost a good portion of the working class fans who plan for a year ahead to get to the Piss Potter Cup. Granted the Lakeshite was dated, but it ticked the "what we like boxes" of the pikey cluster of fans who go there. BDO has a ton of marketing to do to make these events profitable. Not sure how important venues are when watching or attending but unless they are truly dire shit holes I don't think fans think much about it. Sponsors care more about the overall presentation of an event not where it is held. Ok again you don't want a shit hole but you need atmosphere and good crowd visuals, but most of the action is focused on that tiny stage. A huge empty venue or even a mid size venue is worse than a small venue that generates excitement. Ok the Tavern might be a good fit for the Masters. But they are going to have to do plenty of marketing so that is money out the door there as the milkman brigade isn't going to suffice. Flyers in the butcher shop doesn't cut it either.

Sponsors like One80 and L-Style aren't known or have a history of bringing bags of money to the table. Other than Nodor\Winmau and Unicorn who is the other big name in darts and known to splash money, so why didn't they come to the table to fill the gap and do it on the cheap? Target is the answer and they also make boards, seems to me expanding Targets market share in boards would be an important strategy in the overall brand. So one has to ask the question why didn't they step in and get this on the cheap? They sponsor BDO players, most notably the ladies Champ in Mikuru. I highly doubt One80 and L-Style put more money out to the BDO than Target could. Not convinced the deal One80 and L-style gave the BDO is for much.

Same goes for Eurosport and Quest. Do we really think they are paying much for the rights to one money maker and 2 millstones? These are relatively small players as far as TV market shares go. Eurosport has splashed some money around in certain sports, but those are proven products and given that the cost of those rights probably cost them a big bag of cash or two. They aren't going to be spending much on darts as it is a filler something they can cram in here and there on one of their 4 channels. Quest? does any fucker know where that is on the dial, 257 or something?

End of the day Profits is the same around the globe; Revenues-Cost. I don't see the BDO position being any better, and if your locking yourself into a 3 year deal of losses. Security and certainty in this case is 3 years of losses. That is far worse than a one year deal where you lose, but can then next year make some changes like scraping the WDT for starters.

In short: I think that a lot of mushrooms are polishing turds with this proclaiming a multi year deal is forward progress.
Probably the best thought out post I've seen for a long time, covers pretty much every aspect of this "New Era"
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by skweezit » Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:19 pm

so one80 is going to supply the dartboards to the BDO.
what's winmau going to do and/or where are they going?

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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by M H » Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:56 pm

skweezit wrote:
Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:19 pm
so one80 is going to supply the dartboards to the BDO.
what's winmau going to do and/or where are they going?
Winmau will save shitloads in cash and continue sponsoring players as they do now. The BDO didn't want them to go
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:20 pm

I was going to post something on the Hearn announcement of an announcement on TV deal for darts in the American market. But I'm going to reserve judgement till I hear what the actual announcement is. I have followed the ratings on darts here and it hasn't been good, and that is an understatement. The last few years the only mileage they have gotten is on the streaming of PL via BBC America. I have a feeling the PDC pretty much gave that away to see what the impact would be. A few years ago they streamed PDC worlds and cup I think it was 2015 thru 2017. But again ESPN probably wasn't paying much for it and ESPN streaming service isn't a huge or wasn't a huge share of the market for viewing sports. Live TV is still far and away the way sports is viewed. ESPN reply of PDC highlights were always extremely poor numbers, occasionally they would make the top 100 original aired programs and they would be likely to tick in at 50K. The year that fox aired the U.S. masters I think it was 2017, they slapped on FS2 which isn't widespread and it was all on delay after Gold Cup so they got some boost from fat fucks too lazy to change the channel at 1 AM. The touted 1. whatever million per week that was reported for the BBC America airing PL last year was a culminative number over the 14 weeks or so. It was not a weekly number as falsely reported. No way in hell are you getting a million viewers a week because if they were they would have slapped that shit on the OTA broadcast because that number destroys pretty much every other show they air that time of day and more than likely most of the stuff they show in Prime Time as well.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:24 pm

I'm guessing Hearn cut a deal for that DAZN streaming service at least for some events. If that is the case not an earth shattering move. More akin to the impact of a wet fart in a hurricane.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:58 pm

Ok so I went back and checked the numbers specifically for the BBC America broadcast of PL and World Champs for 2019. BBC America had only a half dozen or so nights of their OTA broadcast of darts that made it into the top 150 cable shows of the day. Lowest entry for them was 70k+ the other entries were just over 110k+ or so. Pretty miniscule in terms of the market here.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:11 pm

Meanwhile on ESPN2 this summer Cornhole was shown, yes that stupid game that you toss bean bags into a hole in a piece of plywood. Had a few entries in the 140k range and one in the 680k but that was preceded by a show that over million so guessing again lazy fucks not changing the channel. More than likely Cornhole had to bring its own sponsor to buy up a sizeable block of ads, like bowling did when they got back on ESPN.
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Post by cannibal » Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:28 pm

Over the last 2 weeks Hearn and Mardle have lamented that the failure of the BDO would hurt darts. Specifically it would hurt PDC as the BDO is a feeder system. On the face of it this sounds reasonable. But (and you knew it was coming) lets consider what it is that would be lost. Within the UK I would argue not much is lost. Most of the events are organized by other darting bodies like England Darts, Wales, Scotland, and N. Ireland. More than likely those events would continue. In fact I would argue that there might be more events as no one will have to deal with jumping thru the bullshit hoops that the BDO require. Ok your losing an overall system that drives to the Masters and the Worlds. But there is no reason that the forementioned bodies can't pick up the slack and provide the Masters or even something on the scale of the BDO world champs. Might take some time but think it could be done if the bodies were willing to work together.

Counties, super league etc probably would continue just as they do. Maybe they need some oversight or a guiding direction, no reason again that the country bodies can't step in to provide leadership and a proper incentives and structure for advancing players. The big question is would the country cunts be willing to work together. Getting the BDO board mongs out of the way may have been the barrier that kept these groups from working together more closely anyways.

So in terms of what goes on in the UK with darts I don't think much changes. Ok you lose the WDT, but that should have been gone over 2 years ago. The Masters and the world amateurs is a loss for the UK as they are big incentives for the mushrooms. But in the UK you have other events that could fill that void to some degree but the important thing is UK titles exist that are worth chasing and provide competition on a decent standard, things like British Int, 6 nations, Scots open, etc....I readily admit they aren't on the level of importance as the Masters and the World amateurs. But the gap between the UK floor events are a worlds apart in standard from what happens outside the UK except for maybe the Netherlands and a few other places. But in Asia and North America for e.g. the standard of the opens is far lower add to that most of these places aren't playing for much of anything money or prestige. What the BDO offered to darts in these places is that serious amateurs actually had something serious to play for and strive for on the international level. This is where the impact of the demise of the BDO will be felt the greatest as amateurs will have lost the most important international events they have access to. Remember access to the masters is global and far more reaching than the what PDC provides access to for individual countries for PDC events. Might not sound like its not that important but look how countries who have no chance chase Olympic events, Jamaica bobsledding for e.g. But it is that chasing that keeps marginal sports in a country going at the amateur level.

Otoh the demise of the BDO impact on those outlying countries could easily be a boon for the PDC. Now PDC becomes the only game in town for the serious amateur. PDC biggest problem in this case is it doesn't have the global coverage that the BDO has. Once the void is there PDC faces little to no competition in those areas and those places will already have people in place who have run events so they will have easy access to the human capital to establish things for darts in those countries. The cash outlay required to bring these places into the fold of the PDC wouldn't take much because those places are paying the BDO to be in the system. Now they could be looking at cash coming their way or at least far better paying opportunities for their players. The real cash outlay for the PDC comes in expanding the opportunities to get these outlying countries into the PDC system somewhere. A few more events or regional tours would be needed; as well as, changing qualification for other established PDC events.

On the TV\Commercial side of things in darts across the globe the PDC will have no rival in the steel game. They are a monopoly both in the TV game and top end of darts period. That raises their value immensely both for attention of players but also for TV viewers. Sponsors in the industry will now have only 2 places to go to put dosh into the Pro game; PDC and soft tip shit. The soft tip shit now becomes a serious rival for the PDC especially on the player level. On the TV level soft tip shit is several years away from making a TV presence or attempting to seriously (topic for another post). Soft tip is the biggest barrier for the PDC mainly in Asia but also in the USA and to a lesser extent parts of Europe. This is where the capital outlay of the PDC becomes important because Soft Tip has their cunts locked into spending all their time playing their machines. Every companies has created incentives to play x number of matches or participation in this league or that one to get into their premier events. So if these cunts (and some I readily admit are talented) are playing on the plastic board they aren't on the sisal. Therefore they never will reach a level capable of competing at the PDC level to make a viable attempt to make it worthwhile to spend time in the PDC system. Expanding PDC opportunities in these places becomes essential for getting soft tip cunts to concentrate on the real darts. But this hurdle is the one they face already so BDO live or die doesn't change this big obstacle.

So I am not convinced the demise of the BDO as a feeder system is really that big of a deal. In fact after writing all this shit I am more convinced that the demise of the BDO would actually be a net gain for the PDC, especially on the commercial side of things. On the development side of things it might be a temporary set back but the increase in revenues coming in from the demise of the BDO, that is capital they can now invest in the feeder side of things. And lets face reality here, outside of the PDC how much money now is going into the feeder side of things right now from the BDO or WDF?

So now the real question is what are the PDC doing to prepare for the demise of the BDO system? They have to realize it is coming and they can't be stupid enough to sit around and wait for it to happen before coming up with a plan to fill the void. In fact If I was on the board I would be poking the members in the ass with Scott Mitchell's pig poker to motivate them to get some plans together to quicken the demise of the BDO system.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by M H » Thu Aug 08, 2019 5:06 pm

The PDC have the Challenge and Development tours in the UK, the Euro Tour is gaining strength and the World Series although meaningless is enhancing the PDC everywhere else.

There's now only one game in town and the BDO's survival is totally irrelevant
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by skweezit » Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:03 pm

rumor is hearn and the pdc have signed a long term contract with fox sports 1 (usa) to begin in 2020.
no clues on what would be aired.

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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:28 pm

skweezit wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:03 pm
rumor is hearn and the pdc have signed a long term contract with fox sports 1 (usa) to begin in 2020.
no clues on what would be aired.
Curious as to what your source is on this? No names needed, just player, promotor, etc. Or are you just basing it of what Hearn said, in which case isn't rumor really.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:33 pm

I found it interesting that fox didn't pick this up this year for the US Masters again. PDC two years ago hired or contracted an ex Fox Sports guy to apparently help them get a fox deal done. And makes sense as Fox has a history of decent sucess with niche sports. I'm going to venture a guess that fox sell off had something to do with this delay.
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Re: Cannibal's darts vendetta thread; sponsored by skweezit

Post by cannibal » Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:49 am

cannibal wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:28 pm
skweezit wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:03 pm
rumor is hearn and the pdc have signed a long term contract with fox sports 1 (usa) to begin in 2020.
no clues on what would be aired.
Curious as to what your source is on this? No names needed, just player, promotor, etc. Or are you just basing it of what Hearn said, in which case isn't rumor really.
Again another question asked of skweeshit on his source of bullshit he posts and no answer.
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