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HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:13 am
You are missing the point. I am not saying Ted would have won in 2000 I just think if the split never happened, a lot of things would have been different. For example 1998 Les Wallace could have knocked Taylor out in round 1
You can’t base everything on averages.
I do think Taylor would certainly be in double figures though for world title wins.
I literally posted above that Taylor would probably get caught in the opening rounds a few times.
Granted averages are not everything, as John Part showed in the 2003 final when he beat Taylor averaging 3 points fewer, but I fail to see why you think Hankey was better than his numbers suggest. Why argue that Hankey would have won in a unified field and not players from his era who won Lakeside with better stats, and therefore probably had a higher ceiling to their game? Walton, in addition to impressive averages in 2001, was also very consistent especially when it came to doubling. What in Hankey's game, which is perhaps not reflected so much in the stats, do you believe would have enabled him to a world title in a unified field?
The split would have changed the course of darts, but one thing is for sure is that it would become harder for players in both codes to win world titles (only 1 world championship and with a greater talent pool). That automatically reduces the chances of Hankey winning one.
Hankeys scoring power eg 180s
I think he is better than the vast majority of post split BDO champions with only Barney, Adams and Duzza better.
Ted had natural talent and actually didn’t achieve as much as he should have done ( which you yourself have admitted on here previously)
My view is that playing better players will bring out the best in the other really good players.
Take Gary Anderson as an example, never won lakeside but has 2 PDC titles.
This was won by Kendji Steinbach who beat Plaisier 6-5 in the final. He is 15. Uh oh. Here they are standing side by side after an event earlier this year.
HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:38 am
Hankeys scoring power eg 180s
I think he is better than the vast majority of post split BDO champions with only Barney, Adams and Duzza better.
Ted had natural talent and actually didn’t achieve as much as he should have done ( which you yourself have admitted on here previously)
My view is that playing better players will bring out the best in the other really good players.
Take Gary Anderson as an example, never won lakeside but has 2 PDC titles.
Anderson took years to get used to playing on TV and never seemed to like playing at Lakeside for some reason. He always had the game. He dominated Adams in head to head between 2005 and 2009 IIRC, and won the IDL/WT in 2007.
You could make the "playing better players will bring out the best" argument with literally anyone and it doesn't always work that way. Look at how Bunting fared when he initially switched to the PDC from the BDO. He even considered retirement at one stage.
Funnily enough, Hankey played better statistically in every round in 2001 than he did in 2000. The difference was that he ran into Walton in the final and not a distracted Baxter. Yet he couldn't raise his game enough to win. After which, BDO was probably at its strongest post-split, yet rather than the strong competition bringing out the best in Hankey, he didn't make another BDO major final until 2004 (which he lost convincingly to Headshaker), and after that wouldn't make another until Lakeside 2009 (at which point the BDO had weakened from it's early-mid 00s post-split pomp)
Thus, I really can't see an alternative version of reality where Hankey would make better use of his natural talent (which I admit he had in spades), or win a world title in a unified field.
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 10:29 am
by Cooking with Sanchez
There’s obvious comparisons between Hankey, Taylor, Klaasen, Eccles etc.
HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:38 am
Hankeys scoring power eg 180s
I think he is better than the vast majority of post split BDO champions with only Barney, Adams and Duzza better.
Ted had natural talent and actually didn’t achieve as much as he should have done ( which you yourself have admitted on here previously)
My view is that playing better players will bring out the best in the other really good players.
Take Gary Anderson as an example, never won lakeside but has 2 PDC titles.
Anderson took years to get used to playing on TV and never seemed to like playing at Lakeside for some reason. He always had the game. He dominated Adams in head to head between 2005 and 2009 IIRC, and won the IDL/WT in 2007.
You could make the "playing better players will bring out the best" argument with literally anyone and it doesn't always work that way. Look at how Bunting fared when he initially switched to the PDC from the BDO. He even considered retirement at one stage.
Funnily enough, Hankey played better statistically in every round in 2001 than he did in 2000. The difference was that he ran into Walton in the final and not a distracted Baxter. Yet he couldn't raise his game enough to win. After which, BDO was probably at its strongest post-split, yet rather than the strong competition bringing out the best in Hankey, he didn't make another BDO major final until 2004 (which he lost convincingly to Headshaker), and after that wouldn't make another until Lakeside 2009 (at which point the BDO had weakened from it's early-mid 00s post-split pomp)
Thus, I really can't see an alternative version of reality where Hankey would make better use of his natural talent (which I admit he had in spades), or win a world title in a unified field.
Bunting initially did very well, it was after where he had a slump. I personally don’t believe he would have ever considered retiring.
As for Ted, who knows. Everything is ‘subjective’
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 10:46 am
by HalloweenJack
Cooking with Sanchez wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 10:29 am
There’s obvious comparisons between Hankey, Taylor, Klaasen, Eccles etc.
I don’t remember Eccles winning a world title mate
HalloweenJack wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:38 am
Hankeys scoring power eg 180s
I think he is better than the vast majority of post split BDO champions with only Barney, Adams and Duzza better.
Ted had natural talent and actually didn’t achieve as much as he should have done ( which you yourself have admitted on here previously)
My view is that playing better players will bring out the best in the other really good players.
Take Gary Anderson as an example, never won lakeside but has 2 PDC titles.
Anderson took years to get used to playing on TV and never seemed to like playing at Lakeside for some reason. He always had the game. He dominated Adams in head to head between 2005 and 2009 IIRC, and won the IDL/WT in 2007.
You could make the "playing better players will bring out the best" argument with literally anyone and it doesn't always work that way. Look at how Bunting fared when he initially switched to the PDC from the BDO. He even considered retirement at one stage.
Funnily enough, Hankey played better statistically in every round in 2001 than he did in 2000. The difference was that he ran into Walton in the final and not a distracted Baxter. Yet he couldn't raise his game enough to win. After which, BDO was probably at its strongest post-split, yet rather than the strong competition bringing out the best in Hankey, he didn't make another BDO major final until 2004 (which he lost convincingly to Headshaker), and after that wouldn't make another until Lakeside 2009 (at which point the BDO had weakened from it's early-mid 00s post-split pomp)
Thus, I really can't see an alternative version of reality where Hankey would make better use of his natural talent (which I admit he had in spades), or win a world title in a unified field.
Bunting initially did very well, it was after where he had a slump. I personally don’t believe he would have ever considered retiring.
As for Ted, who knows. Everything is ‘subjective’
Guess again -
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 10:50 am
by sennafan24
Thankfully, I can forget that Eccles ever existed.
This was won by Kendji Steinbach who beat Plaisier 6-5 in the final. He is 15. Uh oh. Here they are standing side by side after an event earlier this year.
Taylor would have had tougher matches in the opening rounds of the BDO then the PDC
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 3:39 pm
by HalloweenJack
oche balboa wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 3:32 pm
Taylor would have had tougher matches in the opening rounds of the BDO then the PDC
This, certainly in the early 2000s.
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 3:51 pm
by oche balboa
Phil Taylors first round player vs BDO World Number 1
1999: Taylor vs Harding, Barney vs Palfrey
2000: Taylor vs Manning, Barney vs Mason
2001: Taylor vs Justice, King vs Mason
2002: Taylor vs Williams, Walton vs Fordham
2003: Taylor vs S.Brown, David vs Sorensen
2004: Taylor vs McGarry, Barneveld vs Hunt
2005: Taylor vs Roy, Barney vs Anderson
2006: Taylor vs Platt, King vs Woods
2007: Taylor vs Pein, Adams vs O'Shea
2008: Taylor vs MVG, Webster vs Jones (Perhaps then it was harder in the PDC)
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 4:43 pm
by TheMalteseDart
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 5:42 pm
by PT13
The BDO/WDF 1993 Finchley and Las Vegas bans on BDO players even associating with WDC players (a ban which remained in place until 1997), are why the WDC/PDC depth wasn't stronger a lot earlier. BDO supporters in the split also like to ignore how nearly all pre-split TV tournament winners were in the WDC from the beginning.
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 5:46 pm
by The Thorn
We all know the PDC can do no wrong so go hang out of Matt Porters arse
Re: Random Dart Stuff
Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2024 8:35 pm
by sennafan24
oche balboa wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 3:51 pm
Phil Taylors first round player vs BDO World Number 1
1999: Taylor vs Harding, Barney vs Palfrey
2000: Taylor vs Manning, Barney vs Mason
2001: Taylor vs Justice, King vs Mason
2002: Taylor vs Williams, Walton vs Fordham
2003: Taylor vs S.Brown, David vs Sorensen
2004: Taylor vs McGarry, Barneveld vs Hunt
2005: Taylor vs Roy, Barney vs Anderson
2006: Taylor vs Platt, King vs Woods
2007: Taylor vs Pein, Adams vs O'Shea
2008: Taylor vs MVG, Webster vs Jones (Perhaps then it was harder in the PDC)
2006-2008 the PDC had 64 man fields whereas the BDO still had 32 man fields.
