The Darts Forum

tungsten tossers wrote:

Zeyes wrote:

tungsten tossers wrote:I think QS would be better if held over two weekends.. more games and a better chance to see who is more consistent.

IMHO, Q School is getting to the point where it needs to be played in two stages. The large number of no-hopers in the field means that there are just too many meaningless games and at the same time too much luck of the draw. I'd be in favour of letting the small fry fight it out for one weekend in early December, let's say for 64 spots (4 tournaments, last 16 of each qualify), who then join the "real" Q School in January. All players proven to be reasonably competent (recent tour card holders, high finishers of the CT and DT and regional tours, players who did well on the Pro Tour without tour cards) to get exempted directly into the January QS.

Would lead to a Q School proper with maybe 200-250 players, rather than the 600+ we saw this year across the two sites. In addition, paring down the field like that could allow them to play more tournaments in the same four days, so your objective would be fulfilled, too.

Good shout.. a prelim Q School could work..
Lets face it there were a lot of players that didn't win a game this year and those would be eliminated at prelim.. There were 183 players that ended up with zero points in the Uk QS alone..and another 70 that only got 1 point..
There were 453 entrants for the UK so if it gets much bigger it will become unworkable anyway.
I am sure something must be in the pipeline as it could be a logistical nightmare

Really like what both of you have said.

This year's Q-School must be proof if any that there needs to be a much smaller field for any future editions. Seeing those draw pages start at the last 512 with tens if not hundreds of byes was mindblowing.

Fiss Plaps wrote:

tungsten tossers wrote:

Zeyes wrote:

tungsten tossers wrote:I think QS would be better if held over two weekends.. more games and a better chance to see who is more consistent.

IMHO, Q School is getting to the point where it needs to be played in two stages. The large number of no-hopers in the field means that there are just too many meaningless games and at the same time too much luck of the draw. I'd be in favour of letting the small fry fight it out for one weekend in early December, let's say for 64 spots (4 tournaments, last 16 of each qualify), who then join the "real" Q School in January. All players proven to be reasonably competent (recent tour card holders, high finishers of the CT and DT and regional tours, players who did well on the Pro Tour without tour cards) to get exempted directly into the January QS.

Would lead to a Q School proper with maybe 200-250 players, rather than the 600+ we saw this year across the two sites. In addition, paring down the field like that could allow them to play more tournaments in the same four days, so your objective would be fulfilled, too.

Good shout.. a prelim Q School could work..
Lets face it there were a lot of players that didn't win a game this year and those would be eliminated at prelim.. There were 183 players that ended up with zero points in the Uk QS alone..and another 70 that only got 1 point..
There were 453 entrants for the UK so if it gets much bigger it will become unworkable anyway.
I am sure something must be in the pipeline as it could be a logistical nightmare

Really like what both of you have said.

This year's Q-School must be proof if any that there needs to be a much smaller field for any future editions. Seeing those draw pages start at the last 512 with tens if not hundreds of byes was mindblowing.

Exactly.. it must confuse the hell out of some of the players too, especially Cammie
I am sure that there will be more entries this year too..
The CT is something that definitely needs looking at.. Five weekends of four events doesn't give the players trying to move up to the next level, enough year round tournaments. Cammie and Ratty missed four events due to qualifying for an ET event which equates to 20% of the tour. It is a tough call for the players that need the money to fund their tour so we cannot expect them not to try and qualify for ET events. An extended. CT would see a proper second tier for the players and give them more meaningful matchplay.

Maybe we should send our ideas to Bazza

Nerd alert: Several years ago I drew up this concept for a two-stage Q School (slightly adjusted here for things that have changed since then, i.e. new tours etc.):

Exempted to second stage:

- top 128 + ties of the Pro Tour OOM
- top 64 + ties of the Challenge Tour OOM
- top 32 + ties of the Development Tour OOM
- top 64 + ties of the previous Q School OOM
- any tour card holder in either of the last two years
- any World Championship participant (PDC/BDO) in the last two runnings
- players who won prize money in other Premier Ranked events in the season
- players who qualified for at least 2 European Tour events in the season
- top 8 of each affiliated circuit (Asian Tour, SDC, DPA, CDC, etc. etc.)

The Premier Ranked rule was more meaningful in the past, when it was still possible to qualify for the Grand Slam and the European Championship as non-tour players, but might still be worth keeping to catch players who go deep in the UK Open. The European Tour rule is mainly for those continental players who don't really have a regional tour to play in, so the ET qualifying events would serve as their "tour".

Anyway, the last time I checked the fields based on these criteria was back in 2015...there were about 270 eligible players then, 130 of whom actually signed up to Q School that year. The take-up rate would probably be higher nowadays, so maybe 150-160 at a guess.

That second stage Q School would revert to being played in only one location - I think it's important that all tour card hopefuls get measured against each other, without any regional quotas.

The first stage could still be played split between the UK and continental Europe to cut down on player travel. Limited to 256 spots in the UK, 128 in Europe, first come first serve, tough luck if you didn't sign up quickly enough. 4 tournaments at each site, played Saturday/Sunday (so two per day). Last 16 (UK) / last 8 (EU) of each tourney qualify, meaning 25% of all players go through. No points lists or any other complications here - if you can't make the last 16/8 even once in four attempts in those fields (which would be devoid of the top ~400 players in the world), you have no business competing for a tour card later anyway.

Add these 64+32 prelim qualifiers to the exempted players, and you've got 250 players or so in January. There's still going to be some dross in there, that's unavoidable, but it'll be players who were actually decent at some point and just don't have it during the Q School week, rather than pub players who will never average better than 70 and just take up space.

And with ~250 players they could easily expand Q School to six tournaments in four days (three per each two days, the middle one split between the days), or possibly even to eight tournaments, for a more meaningful ranking. Win-win-win all around, with minimal extra effort required...just the one added floor weekend in December, and producing the exemption lists.

Thanks to Burton.

Ratajski has dropped out of the provisional spots for the Euros, a 5k drop. Searle, de Graaf and Painter have overtaken him.

The good news is that he will surely be playing the final 4 Players Championships (and Ally Pally).

Nothing for Ratters in PC19/20 then, drops below "Darren Johnson". That can't be good.


Burton DeWitt @bsd987
Danny Noppert looking likely to move into the Top 50 after Worlds, as Kevin Painter drops closer to losing his Tour Card post-Ally Pally.

Adios Kevin, was nice knowing you.
Actully it wasn't.

Rowby-Jane back in the hunt. Add 7,500 for reaching Ally Pally, double that if he wins a match there.

Be funtimes if he draws Ratajski in Round 1 at the Worlds. It could effectively be a play-off for a tour card.

Rogg wrote:Rowby-Jane back in the hunt. Add 7,500 for reaching Ally Pally, double that if he wins a match there.

Be funtimes if he draws Ratajski in Round 1 at the Worlds. It could effectively be a play-off for a tour card.

He will draw one of the Ladies who will qualify

oche balboa wrote:

Rogg wrote:Rowby-Jane back in the hunt. Add 7,500 for reaching Ally Pally, double that if he wins a match there.

Be funtimes if he draws Ratajski in Round 1 at the Worlds. It could effectively be a play-off for a tour card.

He will draw one of the Ladies who will qualify

He can't, ProTour players are up against international/invitational players in round 1. Even if he does well in the last few ProTour events, he will be considered an international qualifier

Krzysztof "Frank Spencer" Ratajski overtakes Johnson but is overtaken by Clemens.

He has 2 Players Championships to add plus Ally Pally. It could be politely suggested that he wins some games of darts during these. If he makes about 10k at the PCs he might even make the PC Finals.


Burton DeWitt @bsd987
Here's the post-World Championship Order of Merit. By sneaking into the European Championship, Paul Nicholson has probably saved his Tour Card for 2018. Richard North and Max Hopp each narrow the gap towards debuts in the Top 32.

Fucks sake hows Ronny Huybrechts still there

The Thorn wrote:Fucks sake hows Ronny Huybrechts still there

He has a few 5k winnings plus a Uk open qualifier final plus his ally pally money.
He has not won much this year so next year we should see him fall

tungsten tossers wrote:

The Thorn wrote:Fucks sake hows Ronny Huybrechts still there

He has a few 5k winnings plus a Uk open qualifier final plus his ally pally money.
He has not won much this year so next year we should see him fall

Good.

Former world champions Part and Burnett looked fucked for sure. Honestly can't see either of them striking lightening again to win a tour card at q school. Shame as I was sort of interested in seeing mad dog Prince of Wales Burnett making a come back, well at least for a laugh. Part been done and dusted for nigh on 4 years now.

If Ratajski misses 64th place by less than GSOD first-round money...

cannibal wrote:Former world champions Part and Burnett looked fucked for sure. Honestly can't see either of them striking lightening again to win a tour card at q school. Shame as I was sort of interested in seeing mad dog Prince of Wales Burnett making a come back, well at least for a laugh. Part been done and dusted for nigh on 4 years now.

I suppose there could always be an Eddie Dootson type who just has a good weekend at Q-School even now, but yeah, the field is stronger now than before, I can't see them regaining their tour cards

Clayton,Merv,Steve B and Big John all top 20

Can't remember the last time Dobey,Kist,Jacques or R Huybrechts were on the telly or euro tour?

Massive jump by Ratters. Minimum 2500 at the PC Finals is now on his total too.


Burton DeWitt‏ @bsd987
Krzysztof Ratajski may just have done enough to win himself a Tour Card for next year. I've been thinking around the £52,000 all year, and today's title plus Minehead money would put him just above it.

That is a joy to behold. Well done Krzysztof, tears in my eyes.